1 00:00:04,999 --> 00:00:01,600 [Applause] 2 00:00:08,450 --> 00:00:05,009 all right so I wanted to start out with 3 00:00:10,759 --> 00:00:08,460 a question and in fact truth is is that 4 00:00:12,290 --> 00:00:10,769 about what I'm going to talk I have a 5 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:12,300 lot more questions than I have answers 6 00:00:18,170 --> 00:00:16,170 and so the question I wanted to start 7 00:00:20,450 --> 00:00:18,180 you out with is what does a society 8 00:00:25,820 --> 00:00:20,460 really know about what's going on within 9 00:00:27,589 --> 00:00:25,830 it we assume that the social 10 00:00:29,029 --> 00:00:27,599 intelligence we get about what's 11 00:00:31,519 --> 00:00:29,039 happening around us is reasonably 12 00:00:35,690 --> 00:00:31,529 accurate what I'm going to talk about is 13 00:00:38,150 --> 00:00:35,700 a category of events which we don't get 14 00:00:41,150 --> 00:00:38,160 actually a lot of social intelligence 15 00:00:43,910 --> 00:00:41,160 and so what I'm going to talk about is 16 00:00:48,049 --> 00:00:43,920 UFO abductions I know this is quite a 17 00:00:50,779 --> 00:00:48,059 jump after Rama ethics talk but I think 18 00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:50,789 this is a very important issue now I'm 19 00:00:55,970 --> 00:00:52,410 going to talk about why the French don't 20 00:00:59,299 --> 00:00:55,980 have abductions or think they don't okay 21 00:01:02,420 --> 00:00:59,309 so you're all familiar I assume with the 22 00:01:05,870 --> 00:01:02,430 category of alien abductions this is an 23 00:01:08,660 --> 00:01:05,880 enormous ly strong part of popular 24 00:01:11,539 --> 00:01:08,670 culture we all have image of how this 25 00:01:12,649 --> 00:01:11,549 stuff operates and so forth I'm not 26 00:01:14,179 --> 00:01:12,659 really going to go into this in much 27 00:01:16,280 --> 00:01:14,189 detail because I'm much more interested 28 00:01:18,859 --> 00:01:16,290 in the reporting process how does 29 00:01:23,810 --> 00:01:18,869 society find out about stuff like this 30 00:01:25,490 --> 00:01:23,820 and so the basic problem I'm going to 31 00:01:28,219 --> 00:01:25,500 consider is why is it that the French 32 00:01:30,830 --> 00:01:28,229 don't think that they have abductions 33 00:01:36,700 --> 00:01:30,840 and of course your question might be why 34 00:01:40,580 --> 00:01:36,710 would I think that they do okay so the 35 00:01:42,050 --> 00:01:40,590 the data are kind of interesting how big 36 00:01:47,030 --> 00:01:42,060 is the difference between what the 37 00:01:49,910 --> 00:01:47,040 French see and what we see okay so what 38 00:01:53,030 --> 00:01:49,920 I did to find out how many abductions 39 00:01:56,060 --> 00:01:53,040 have been publicly reported as I called 40 00:01:57,770 --> 00:01:56,070 up Dave Jacobs who has spent the great 41 00:01:59,539 --> 00:01:57,780 majority of his life actually at this 42 00:02:03,530 --> 00:01:59,549 point looking at the abduction 43 00:02:04,789 --> 00:02:03,540 phenomenon and I said well considering 44 00:02:06,889 --> 00:02:04,799 all the people who are looking at 45 00:02:09,139 --> 00:02:06,899 abductions and so forth what do you 46 00:02:11,330 --> 00:02:09,149 think the number of reported cases is 47 00:02:13,510 --> 00:02:11,340 and we talked about this for some time 48 00:02:23,110 --> 00:02:13,520 this is a figure we arrived at 49 00:02:25,570 --> 00:02:23,120 okay now believe it or not this appears 50 00:02:28,210 --> 00:02:25,580 to be that number that the French have 51 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:28,220 arrived at okay and why do I say that 52 00:02:37,240 --> 00:02:31,250 well here's a good example of why there 53 00:02:40,300 --> 00:02:37,250 aren't French abduction cases okay if 54 00:02:42,520 --> 00:02:40,310 you look at the number of people in 55 00:02:44,920 --> 00:02:42,530 France it's five it's one fifth of what 56 00:02:47,050 --> 00:02:44,930 the US population is okay so if we 57 00:02:51,070 --> 00:02:47,060 equalize the populations and so forth 58 00:02:52,960 --> 00:02:51,080 the United States would have 15,000 59 00:02:55,030 --> 00:02:52,970 cases instead of seventy five thousand 60 00:02:57,700 --> 00:02:55,040 cases and France would have one hundred 61 00:02:59,410 --> 00:02:57,710 okay if you divide one into the other it 62 00:03:02,770 --> 00:02:59,420 comes out a hundred and fifty times 63 00:03:05,650 --> 00:03:02,780 could there possibly be one hundred and 64 00:03:10,930 --> 00:03:05,660 fifty times the abductions in the United 65 00:03:15,100 --> 00:03:10,940 States if there are in France no can't 66 00:03:17,650 --> 00:03:15,110 okay so there are two possible 67 00:03:21,010 --> 00:03:17,660 explanations and by the way the original 68 00:03:22,570 --> 00:03:21,020 version of this talk was quite funny but 69 00:03:24,250 --> 00:03:22,580 people told me to take out all the 70 00:03:26,740 --> 00:03:24,260 slides making fun of the French and the 71 00:03:28,990 --> 00:03:26,750 Americans respectively so you'll have to 72 00:03:31,720 --> 00:03:29,000 think what I would have put instead so 73 00:03:34,540 --> 00:03:31,730 the first hypothesis is simply that the 74 00:03:36,850 --> 00:03:34,550 Americans have simply imagined or 75 00:03:38,430 --> 00:03:36,860 misidentified abductions through some 76 00:03:41,140 --> 00:03:38,440 sort of mass hysteria or 77 00:03:43,780 --> 00:03:41,150 misidentification process aided by rumor 78 00:03:45,580 --> 00:03:43,790 or popular fantasy and I'm sure that 79 00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:45,590 most Americans who think about it are 80 00:03:50,230 --> 00:03:47,570 probably inclined to this explanation 81 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:50,240 the other explanation is maybe the 82 00:03:54,730 --> 00:03:52,130 French has the same number of abduction 83 00:03:56,620 --> 00:03:54,740 experiences but they are not as likely 84 00:03:59,800 --> 00:03:56,630 to report them so let's look at these 85 00:04:01,600 --> 00:03:59,810 two hypotheses okay so first of all 86 00:04:03,460 --> 00:04:01,610 let's look at hypothesis number one what 87 00:04:04,510 --> 00:04:03,470 our abduction case is like and I'm not 88 00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:04,520 going to go into this in great detail 89 00:04:08,199 --> 00:04:06,050 because I think most of you have already 90 00:04:10,780 --> 00:04:08,209 been subjected to this it's on but 91 00:04:13,390 --> 00:04:10,790 basically an abduction consists of a 92 00:04:15,340 --> 00:04:13,400 period of missing time and memory 93 00:04:17,289 --> 00:04:15,350 frequently obtained under hypnosis of 94 00:04:19,210 --> 00:04:17,299 being taken aboard a UFO further 95 00:04:22,060 --> 00:04:19,220 memories of sexual intervention by alien 96 00:04:24,250 --> 00:04:22,070 beings and interestingly enough most 97 00:04:25,480 --> 00:04:24,260 cases a history of similar previous 98 00:04:31,129 --> 00:04:25,490 experiences 99 00:04:34,129 --> 00:04:31,139 okay the problem with this is just I 100 00:04:35,809 --> 00:04:34,139 must have skipped a slide here I go back 101 00:04:38,029 --> 00:04:35,819 yeah here we go 102 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:38,039 okay so common sense suggests that 103 00:04:43,330 --> 00:04:40,770 waking up or coming coming in to sleep 104 00:04:45,679 --> 00:04:43,340 provides a time of high suggestibility 105 00:04:47,450 --> 00:04:45,689 furthermore hypnosis provides a ready 106 00:04:49,129 --> 00:04:47,460 means of implanting false memories 107 00:04:51,890 --> 00:04:49,139 especially associated with popular 108 00:04:55,129 --> 00:04:51,900 culture so maybe it's all the false 109 00:04:58,640 --> 00:04:55,139 memory syndrome the problem with this is 110 00:05:01,670 --> 00:04:58,650 that abduction cases if you look at them 111 00:05:04,369 --> 00:05:01,680 as a whole don't really fall very well 112 00:05:07,100 --> 00:05:04,379 into this framework for instance many 113 00:05:10,939 --> 00:05:07,110 abductions take place while awake or 114 00:05:15,080 --> 00:05:10,949 driving some abductions involve pairs of 115 00:05:16,990 --> 00:05:15,090 people or larger groups some abductions 116 00:05:19,129 --> 00:05:17,000 are witnessed by those not abducted 117 00:05:21,559 --> 00:05:19,139 sometimes people wake up in the wrong 118 00:05:23,719 --> 00:05:21,569 bed or with the wrong pajamas or by the 119 00:05:26,689 --> 00:05:23,729 way with other stuff that suggests that 120 00:05:28,790 --> 00:05:26,699 they've been outside and finally what 121 00:05:33,499 --> 00:05:28,800 causes the post-traumatic stress if this 122 00:05:35,059 --> 00:05:33,509 is simply an hallucination okay all 123 00:05:37,249 --> 00:05:35,069 right so let's look at hypothesis number 124 00:05:39,559 --> 00:05:37,259 two maybe the Americans and the French 125 00:05:41,679 --> 00:05:39,569 have the same rate of experiences but 126 00:05:44,689 --> 00:05:41,689 the Americans are more likely to report 127 00:05:46,579 --> 00:05:44,699 okay so maybe abductions in France are 128 00:05:48,529 --> 00:05:46,589 in the words of one researcher of 129 00:05:53,829 --> 00:05:48,539 near-death experiences Raymond Moody 130 00:06:00,439 --> 00:05:58,010 so this is what I call a hidden event if 131 00:06:03,559 --> 00:06:00,449 this is true and a hidden event 132 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:03,569 basically has a kind of configuration 133 00:06:07,339 --> 00:06:05,250 you see here that the number of cases 134 00:06:08,869 --> 00:06:07,349 that you can see are a very small 135 00:06:11,839 --> 00:06:08,879 fraction of those that are really out 136 00:06:13,879 --> 00:06:11,849 there now in previous talks to the 137 00:06:16,399 --> 00:06:13,889 society I've talked about meteorites 138 00:06:18,139 --> 00:06:16,409 I've talked about the matter and child 139 00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:18,149 syndrome and so forth I've done actually 140 00:06:22,429 --> 00:06:19,770 quite a number of studies on hidden 141 00:06:24,679 --> 00:06:22,439 events and again hidden events are 142 00:06:27,019 --> 00:06:24,689 described by the property of being 143 00:06:30,159 --> 00:06:27,029 widely experienced but very well hidden 144 00:06:33,589 --> 00:06:30,169 okay so 145 00:06:36,139 --> 00:06:33,599 the problem with hidden events is that 146 00:06:37,999 --> 00:06:36,149 we all assume that the social 147 00:06:40,399 --> 00:06:38,009 intelligence system functions in a more 148 00:06:42,589 --> 00:06:40,409 or less constant way this stuff kind of 149 00:06:46,730 --> 00:06:42,599 percolates up and more or less a steady 150 00:06:49,219 --> 00:06:46,740 rate and doesn't change but maybe it 151 00:06:51,499 --> 00:06:49,229 isn't consistent if we see it as a 152 00:06:53,329 --> 00:06:51,509 network system the chances the sighting 153 00:06:55,429 --> 00:06:53,339 is passed through it may change greatly 154 00:06:57,589 --> 00:06:55,439 in other words the nodes in the system 155 00:06:59,570 --> 00:06:57,599 don't have a constant propensity but 156 00:07:04,309 --> 00:06:59,580 have a chain but exhibit a changing 157 00:07:06,019 --> 00:07:04,319 parameter to transfer information and so 158 00:07:10,669 --> 00:07:06,029 maybe France has different reporting 159 00:07:13,189 --> 00:07:10,679 parameters so the problem I'm gonna go 160 00:07:15,399 --> 00:07:13,199 to the next one here whoops sorry I 161 00:07:19,969 --> 00:07:15,409 skipped 162 00:07:21,949 --> 00:07:19,979 ah this is what alright so hidden events 163 00:07:25,249 --> 00:07:21,959 go through this following kind of 164 00:07:26,719 --> 00:07:25,259 transformation is that typically in the 165 00:07:30,379 --> 00:07:26,729 beginning they start as uncorrelated 166 00:07:33,169 --> 00:07:30,389 phenomenon previous to 1980 UFO 167 00:07:35,559 --> 00:07:33,179 abductions were just exactly that except 168 00:07:39,949 --> 00:07:35,569 there were probably a handful of cases 169 00:07:43,730 --> 00:07:39,959 and in about 1980 Budd Hopkins published 170 00:07:46,189 --> 00:07:43,740 a book called missing time and after 171 00:07:48,350 --> 00:07:46,199 that people began to collect abduction 172 00:07:50,119 --> 00:07:48,360 cases and I remember saying to Hopkins 173 00:07:52,399 --> 00:07:50,129 at the time I said what what will happen 174 00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:52,409 but if this becomes a paradigm you know 175 00:07:57,859 --> 00:07:55,050 what if it becomes you know something 176 00:08:01,639 --> 00:07:57,869 that appears to be the nature of the UFO 177 00:08:03,799 --> 00:08:01,649 phenomena itself so the second stage 178 00:08:06,559 --> 00:08:03,809 basically happens when there is social 179 00:08:09,889 --> 00:08:06,569 discussion of these events when there's 180 00:08:11,449 --> 00:08:09,899 a period of controversy so the parameter 181 00:08:13,850 --> 00:08:11,459 has changed basically from something 182 00:08:16,329 --> 00:08:13,860 being essentially covered up all of a 183 00:08:19,129 --> 00:08:16,339 sudden something becoming controversial 184 00:08:21,049 --> 00:08:19,139 and finally it can become an accepted 185 00:08:22,999 --> 00:08:21,059 phenomena that I also should have added 186 00:08:24,350 --> 00:08:23,009 it can become completely rejected 187 00:08:29,629 --> 00:08:24,360 somebody could say well this really 188 00:08:30,859 --> 00:08:29,639 didn't exist after all so as we go from 189 00:08:32,629 --> 00:08:30,869 one stage in the hidden event 190 00:08:35,350 --> 00:08:32,639 progression to another the parameters 191 00:08:37,850 --> 00:08:35,360 shift so the reporting becomes higher 192 00:08:40,159 --> 00:08:37,860 this happened with both meteorites and 193 00:08:41,719 --> 00:08:40,169 the battered child syndrome and it also 194 00:08:43,220 --> 00:08:41,729 has happened with a variety of other 195 00:08:45,290 --> 00:08:43,230 things that are like for instance 196 00:08:48,200 --> 00:08:45,300 child syndrome the battered child 197 00:08:51,950 --> 00:08:48,210 syndrome let loose a whole stream of 198 00:08:54,700 --> 00:08:51,960 things about battered spouses sexual 199 00:08:57,860 --> 00:08:54,710 abuse of children someone and so forth 200 00:08:59,420 --> 00:08:57,870 so the interesting thing about the 201 00:09:01,370 --> 00:08:59,430 battered child syndrome is that the 202 00:09:05,150 --> 00:09:01,380 increase in the number of reports was 203 00:09:07,910 --> 00:09:05,160 spectacular originally the people who 204 00:09:09,710 --> 00:09:07,920 were the proponents of the battered 205 00:09:12,800 --> 00:09:09,720 child syndrome thought that there might 206 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:12,810 be hundreds of cases in fact they 207 00:09:17,330 --> 00:09:14,610 actually hired a sociologist to do a 208 00:09:20,750 --> 00:09:17,340 national survey he came up with 700 209 00:09:24,230 --> 00:09:20,760 cases what's the real number well it's 210 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:24,240 more like a million okay how many orders 211 00:09:31,220 --> 00:09:27,930 of magnitude is that quite a few okay so 212 00:09:34,040 --> 00:09:31,230 this is this is ten the nature of a 213 00:09:36,110 --> 00:09:34,050 hidden event is that the part that you 214 00:09:39,230 --> 00:09:36,120 can't see may be orders of magnitude 215 00:09:44,890 --> 00:09:39,240 more than the part that you can see so 216 00:09:48,890 --> 00:09:44,900 what is it the chips of parameters well 217 00:09:51,590 --> 00:09:48,900 obviously what what changes here is that 218 00:09:53,840 --> 00:09:51,600 things begin to become reportable and in 219 00:09:55,850 --> 00:09:53,850 the battered child syndrome case what 220 00:09:57,470 --> 00:09:55,860 happened was we created special social 221 00:10:00,170 --> 00:09:57,480 institutions for looking into battered 222 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:00,180 children child cases many of you may 223 00:10:03,260 --> 00:10:01,530 have had the experience of going to a 224 00:10:04,370 --> 00:10:03,270 hospital with a child with a bloody nose 225 00:10:05,480 --> 00:10:04,380 or something like that 226 00:10:07,420 --> 00:10:05,490 and the next thing you know you're 227 00:10:10,160 --> 00:10:07,430 filling out a questionnaire or you're 228 00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:10,170 responding to a third degree style 229 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:11,610 questions and so forth about what 230 00:10:17,180 --> 00:10:14,490 happened to the child okay so what that 231 00:10:20,750 --> 00:10:17,190 is is a function of the change of the 232 00:10:22,580 --> 00:10:20,760 reporting system now basically said your 233 00:10:24,260 --> 00:10:22,590 that we have parents who are afraid to 234 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:24,270 take their kids to the hospital because 235 00:10:28,130 --> 00:10:25,410 they were afraid they're going to get 236 00:10:30,230 --> 00:10:28,140 reported this child abusers okay whether 237 00:10:32,420 --> 00:10:30,240 this is good or bad another issue but 238 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:32,430 the basic point is that the reporting 239 00:10:37,670 --> 00:10:35,970 changed now in the United States we have 240 00:10:39,110 --> 00:10:37,680 a context that encourages reporting 241 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:39,120 because we have many writers and any 242 00:10:42,830 --> 00:10:41,490 books writing things about abductions we 243 00:10:44,990 --> 00:10:42,840 have lots of talk shows a media 244 00:10:48,410 --> 00:10:45,000 presentation and we have a culture that 245 00:10:51,620 --> 00:10:48,420 encourages you know opening up and 246 00:10:53,990 --> 00:10:51,630 telling it all okay so here are some of 247 00:10:56,090 --> 00:10:54,000 the writers all right many of you will 248 00:11:00,950 --> 00:10:56,100 recognize these books and maybe even the 249 00:11:04,210 --> 00:11:00,960 writers themselves I know everybody but 250 00:11:11,810 --> 00:11:07,250 streamers book had 2 million copies 251 00:11:14,930 --> 00:11:11,820 published 2 million copies that's an 252 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:14,940 awful lot of copies then we have people 253 00:11:20,350 --> 00:11:17,610 like Budd Hopkins who had four books 254 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:20,360 published all of which basically 255 00:11:28,190 --> 00:11:25,770 required a tour and so books lead to 256 00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:28,200 appearances on television on the radio 257 00:11:36,020 --> 00:11:31,730 and magazine articles and elsewhere and 258 00:11:37,460 --> 00:11:36,030 each one of these appearances whereas 259 00:11:40,250 --> 00:11:37,470 the books typically run into the 260 00:11:41,930 --> 00:11:40,260 thousands the appearances in many cases 261 00:11:44,530 --> 00:11:41,940 involve millions of people who can see 262 00:11:51,710 --> 00:11:44,540 these folks talk about the experiences 263 00:11:55,750 --> 00:11:51,720 okay what happens as a result of these 264 00:12:00,470 --> 00:11:58,310 reauthorizations first article on some 265 00:12:03,890 --> 00:12:00,480 little men who were digging holes in a 266 00:12:09,350 --> 00:12:03,900 field in New York City generated sacks 267 00:12:11,300 --> 00:12:09,360 of mail according to his obituary and as 268 00:12:14,110 --> 00:12:11,310 other books presumably generated even 269 00:12:16,670 --> 00:12:14,120 more letters in fact Dave Jacobs who has 270 00:12:21,560 --> 00:12:16,680 Hopkins letters said he got thousands of 271 00:12:25,420 --> 00:12:21,570 letters essentially so what did the 272 00:12:28,070 --> 00:12:25,430 French have to compare with this okay 273 00:12:30,410 --> 00:12:28,080 the book on the Left actually is 274 00:12:32,090 --> 00:12:30,420 published by a popular press and I'm 275 00:12:33,830 --> 00:12:32,100 trying to find out at this moment 276 00:12:35,870 --> 00:12:33,840 actually how many copies of this she got 277 00:12:38,420 --> 00:12:35,880 published and whether she ever appeared 278 00:12:40,370 --> 00:12:38,430 on television or not but for the most 279 00:12:45,290 --> 00:12:40,380 part basic and this is obviously a book 280 00:12:47,750 --> 00:12:45,300 featuring mr. Mack but in French society 281 00:12:49,790 --> 00:12:47,760 they don't talk about abductions 282 00:12:52,100 --> 00:12:49,800 they're not supposed to have abductions 283 00:12:53,540 --> 00:12:52,110 they don't believe in being public and 284 00:12:56,900 --> 00:12:53,550 so forth and so there aren't many 285 00:12:58,430 --> 00:12:56,910 reports now again in each case I'm 286 00:13:00,500 --> 00:12:58,440 trying to quantify all this stuff how 287 00:13:01,500 --> 00:13:00,510 many letters did people get you know how 288 00:13:04,080 --> 00:13:01,510 many 289 00:13:09,270 --> 00:13:04,090 reports are generated by appearances and 290 00:13:10,770 --> 00:13:09,280 so forth but basically oh I know I 291 00:13:13,620 --> 00:13:10,780 should mention too that many of these 292 00:13:15,750 --> 00:13:13,630 books got translated into French and so 293 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:15,760 I called Dave Jacobs and I said well how 294 00:13:23,810 --> 00:13:18,850 many reports have you had from French 295 00:13:29,370 --> 00:13:27,500 that's why publicly the French have 100 296 00:13:33,540 --> 00:13:29,380 abductions they don't seem to have 297 00:13:35,940 --> 00:13:33,550 reports okay so that's the question 298 00:13:38,340 --> 00:13:35,950 really that I'm going to to leave you 299 00:13:40,020 --> 00:13:38,350 with what is it about French society 300 00:13:44,310 --> 00:13:40,030 that discourages people from coming 301 00:13:47,280 --> 00:13:44,320 forward or maybe what's happening here 302 00:13:50,300 --> 00:13:47,290 is some sort of mass contagion maybe 303 00:13:52,590 --> 00:13:50,310 that's really what the explanation is I 304 00:13:54,420 --> 00:13:52,600 don't really believe that for a moment 305 00:13:58,500 --> 00:13:54,430 by the way having spent an awful lot of 306 00:14:00,240 --> 00:13:58,510 time talking to AB deputies know that 307 00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:00,250 there are lots and lots of people out 308 00:14:08,220 --> 00:14:06,250 there that I haven't talked to so what's 309 00:14:10,370 --> 00:14:08,230 really going on here you have two 310 00:14:13,740 --> 00:14:10,380 societies with very different reports 311 00:14:15,480 --> 00:14:13,750 it's one basically the result of some 312 00:14:21,990 --> 00:14:15,490 sort of social phenomenon like mass 313 00:14:25,140 --> 00:14:22,000 contagion and is the other simply the 314 00:14:27,540 --> 00:14:25,150 reflecting of reality or are there lots 315 00:14:29,460 --> 00:14:27,550 of reports aren't out there my 316 00:14:33,570 --> 00:14:29,470 suggestion basically to the French is 317 00:14:37,080 --> 00:14:33,580 why don't you do a survey why don't you 318 00:14:41,300 --> 00:14:37,090 do a survey and find out but so far that 319 00:14:51,689 --> 00:14:47,970 so I leave you with this question what 320 00:14:55,110 --> 00:14:51,699 is it about America that generates these 321 00:14:57,780 --> 00:14:55,120 kinds of reports I remember a book 322 00:15:00,540 --> 00:14:57,790 called welcome to the new age which had 323 00:15:04,379 --> 00:15:00,550 a page on welcome to your local alien 324 00:15:05,670 --> 00:15:04,389 abduction support group okay how many of 325 00:15:08,429 --> 00:15:05,680 you have a community where there's an 326 00:15:10,769 --> 00:15:08,439 alien abduction support group okay 327 00:15:14,449 --> 00:15:10,779 there's more than just right there are 328 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:17,550 it's very unfriending about an alien 329 00:15:24,319 --> 00:15:21,970 abduction support group okay so I think 330 00:15:30,670 --> 00:15:24,329 we have some time for questions 331 00:15:38,350 --> 00:15:32,940 [Applause] 332 00:15:40,780 --> 00:15:38,360 how about Germany Belgium Italy Spain 333 00:15:43,630 --> 00:15:40,790 according to mr. Jacobs he has a website 334 00:15:48,790 --> 00:15:43,640 actually that collects abduction reports 335 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:48,800 and the foreign countries seem to have 336 00:15:54,940 --> 00:15:51,970 the same kind of abductions that we have 337 00:15:57,040 --> 00:15:54,950 they don't have as many but the 338 00:15:59,170 --> 00:15:57,050 interesting thing to me is that mr. 339 00:16:01,720 --> 00:15:59,180 Jacobs who's English and whose website 340 00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:01,730 is in English is getting reports from 341 00:16:10,870 --> 00:16:03,770 France how many reports would he get if 342 00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:10,880 it was in French yes sorry 343 00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:13,970 England are there lots of abduction 344 00:16:18,730 --> 00:16:16,730 cases it Louis yeah any so there no 345 00:16:22,389 --> 00:16:18,740 French website so nobody collecting in 346 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:22,399 France that's your problem and in fact a 347 00:16:27,100 --> 00:16:24,890 French researcher trying to put together 348 00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:27,110 for the recent meeting this is what 349 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:30,890 generated my talk came up with about two 350 00:16:34,210 --> 00:16:32,450 dozen cases and he said most of these 351 00:16:34,690 --> 00:16:34,220 are pretty weak and so forth blah blah 352 00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:34,700 blah 353 00:16:43,220 --> 00:16:38,690 were they English tourists sorry 354 00:16:43,940 --> 00:16:43,230 yeah so I said I don't really believe in 355 00:16:45,710 --> 00:16:43,950 okay 356 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:45,720 now of course the reason I don't believe 357 00:16:50,390 --> 00:16:47,970 it is because yeah I'm familiar with the 358 00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:50,400 dynamics of hidden events I spent a lot 359 00:16:53,390 --> 00:16:51,690 of time looking at the meteorite 360 00:16:55,310 --> 00:16:53,400 controversy I spent a lot of time 361 00:16:58,130 --> 00:16:55,320 looking at the matter child controversy 362 00:17:00,320 --> 00:16:58,140 and the thing about the battered child 363 00:17:01,790 --> 00:17:00,330 controversies in the beginning the 364 00:17:03,500 --> 00:17:01,800 people who were the experts really 365 00:17:05,150 --> 00:17:03,510 believed that wasn't going on at all 366 00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:05,160 the pediatrician stood up on a meeting 367 00:17:08,180 --> 00:17:06,450 he said if I thought parents would do 368 00:17:10,970 --> 00:17:08,190 this to their kids I would get out of 369 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:10,980 Pediatrics immediately okay and that 370 00:17:18,260 --> 00:17:15,450 wasn't an unusual reaction but it wasn't 371 00:17:20,360 --> 00:17:18,270 until special social institutions were 372 00:17:23,300 --> 00:17:20,370 set up to collect reports that they 373 00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:23,310 began to see how big the problem was so 374 00:17:31,100 --> 00:17:28,290 I think this sorry okay thanks very much 375 00:17:33,860 --> 00:17:31,110 I just have a suggestion for you for 376 00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:33,870 follow-up research you may be familiar 377 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:36,090 with Steve Bassett and the disclosure 378 00:17:43,790 --> 00:17:38,810 project paradigm research or maybe not 379 00:17:47,570 --> 00:17:43,800 yeah okay but he's done a lot of 380 00:17:49,580 --> 00:17:47,580 reporting a disclosure or release of UFO 381 00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:49,590 related documents in various countries 382 00:17:54,980 --> 00:17:53,010 and I'm pretty sure France is in the 383 00:17:57,500 --> 00:17:54,990 group that has been releasing some 384 00:17:58,940 --> 00:17:57,510 documents and then you might be able to 385 00:18:01,610 --> 00:17:58,950 check that out on this website that's 386 00:18:03,830 --> 00:18:01,620 over the last just recent maybe two 387 00:18:05,990 --> 00:18:03,840 three years yes secondly he does a 388 00:18:08,090 --> 00:18:06,000 tremendous amount of international as 389 00:18:11,510 --> 00:18:08,100 well as you as speaking he's done a 390 00:18:14,570 --> 00:18:11,520 whole lot in Europe in the last year or 391 00:18:16,370 --> 00:18:14,580 two Steve Bassett paradigm research just 392 00:18:18,860 --> 00:18:16,380 do it on the Google and you'll find it 393 00:18:21,230 --> 00:18:18,870 so he would be a good one for I think 394 00:18:24,830 --> 00:18:21,240 for you to talk with to see if this 395 00:18:27,170 --> 00:18:24,840 topic is coming up in his many 396 00:18:29,990 --> 00:18:27,180 discussions in not only in France but 397 00:18:32,900 --> 00:18:30,000 other European countries so that's just 398 00:18:35,230 --> 00:18:32,910 a suggestion too if you wanted to pursue 399 00:18:37,740 --> 00:18:35,240 this to try to figure out whether 400 00:18:41,500 --> 00:18:37,750 you know where the truth may lie here 401 00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:41,510 yeah I you know the interesting thing 402 00:18:45,850 --> 00:18:43,610 about this is that again it's a function 403 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:45,860 of the reporting system there's lots of 404 00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:48,530 stuff basically that is hidden from you 405 00:18:55,030 --> 00:18:51,410 know ordinary gaze unless you have 406 00:18:57,100 --> 00:18:55,040 special institutions to report so I mean 407 00:18:59,799 --> 00:18:57,110 he may he may make a change and so forth 408 00:19:02,310 --> 00:18:59,809 but I I talked to a French ufologist 409 00:19:04,860 --> 00:19:02,320 Jill does four days is very smart and 410 00:19:06,430 --> 00:19:04,870 who I think is probably one of the best 411 00:19:08,140 --> 00:19:06,440 researchers in the world 412 00:19:11,620 --> 00:19:08,150 he says he's investigated some local 413 00:19:14,710 --> 00:19:11,630 cases but you know people don't talk 414 00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:14,720 about this stuff go ahead there seems to 415 00:19:20,530 --> 00:19:17,570 be a rather similar situation with 416 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:20,540 regard to crop circles as probably you 417 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:23,290 know that there's an extraordinary 418 00:19:31,410 --> 00:19:26,690 concentration in England especially the 419 00:19:36,669 --> 00:19:31,420 south southwest of England and a 420 00:19:42,150 --> 00:19:36,679 remarkably few in France but America is 421 00:19:45,900 --> 00:19:42,160 sort of in between and if you know 422 00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:45,910 frequency or sort of belief of Americans 423 00:19:51,580 --> 00:19:49,610 in weird things is anything to do with 424 00:19:54,100 --> 00:19:51,590 it I would think there would be more in 425 00:19:56,650 --> 00:19:54,110 America one of my original slides had a 426 00:20:05,890 --> 00:19:56,660 book called why people believe weird 427 00:20:08,710 --> 00:20:05,900 things okay yes yes so tell hi Ron I'm 428 00:20:14,560 --> 00:20:08,720 so curious why you picked France of all 429 00:20:17,250 --> 00:20:14,570 the places on the globe I mean I think 430 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:17,260 that well you know why not by 431 00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:20,090 geographical landmass right I mean if 432 00:20:26,770 --> 00:20:23,450 I'm an alien looking to land I'm gonna 433 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:26,780 look at China India Africa you know 434 00:20:34,419 --> 00:20:30,770 something of comparable size yes and the 435 00:20:36,310 --> 00:20:34,429 French love UFOs I mean as a cushy old 436 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:36,320 living in France there were all these 437 00:20:40,510 --> 00:20:38,210 books you know so it's not like they're 438 00:20:40,970 --> 00:20:40,520 hung up and maybe they see one they have 439 00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:40,980 a little 440 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:50,539 obviously I left some things out of this 441 00:20:57,560 --> 00:20:52,890 speech we did a big survey in the United 442 00:21:03,140 --> 00:20:57,570 States called the general referred to as 443 00:21:06,799 --> 00:21:03,150 the Roper report on on UFO abductions we 444 00:21:08,930 --> 00:21:06,809 discovered that we probably were very 445 00:21:13,610 --> 00:21:08,940 conservative in the number of abductions 446 00:21:16,100 --> 00:21:13,620 that we had thought previously I have a 447 00:21:18,350 --> 00:21:16,110 lot of reasons I can't don't have a time 448 00:21:21,380 --> 00:21:18,360 to go and do why I think that there's 449 00:21:22,460 --> 00:21:21,390 probably you know far more obnoxious and 450 00:21:25,370 --> 00:21:22,470 the reports would give you any 451 00:21:27,860 --> 00:21:25,380 indication but suffice to say that I've 452 00:21:29,330 --> 00:21:27,870 never gone to a social gathering where I 453 00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:29,340 mentioned this where somebody didn't 454 00:21:32,539 --> 00:21:31,290 come up to me and they said you know you 455 00:21:36,370 --> 00:21:32,549 know what I'm one of the people you were 456 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:36,380 just talking about okay if they if these 457 00:21:41,900 --> 00:21:38,850 experiences were rare I would not have 458 00:21:46,580 --> 00:21:41,910 that experience so part of me wants to 459 00:21:48,470 --> 00:21:46,590 say it's the garlic you know keeps keeps 460 00:21:51,049 --> 00:21:48,480 away the UFOs like the werewolves and 461 00:21:55,250 --> 00:21:51,059 vampires but but but I just want to say 462 00:21:58,070 --> 00:21:55,260 that it's you know we want to joke about 463 00:22:02,750 --> 00:21:58,080 this but it's really a very very awful 464 00:22:04,370 --> 00:22:02,760 horrible serious since yes yes I really 465 00:22:07,430 --> 00:22:04,380 for board going into the nature of 466 00:22:08,810 --> 00:22:07,440 abduction events now I did that for a 467 00:22:09,950 --> 00:22:08,820 reason the reason was I'm much more 468 00:22:14,120 --> 00:22:09,960 interested at the moment in the 469 00:22:16,039 --> 00:22:14,130 reporting process but if I hadn't had a 470 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:16,049 lot of field experience talking to 471 00:22:20,780 --> 00:22:17,970 abductees and so forth I wouldn't be 472 00:22:23,900 --> 00:22:20,790 standing up here I'm very interested in 473 00:22:26,030 --> 00:22:23,910 this and you know when I went off to the 474 00:22:27,770 --> 00:22:26,040 ocula Indian Reservation to study UFOs 475 00:22:29,330 --> 00:22:27,780 there I came across two abduction 476 00:22:32,270 --> 00:22:29,340 experiences just in the course of two 477 00:22:34,730 --> 00:22:32,280 weeks this is an Indian Reservation 478 00:22:38,090 --> 00:22:34,740 which has presumably different culture 479 00:22:40,100 --> 00:22:38,100 than the rest of the country I came 480 00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:40,110 across two very strong abduction cases 481 00:22:45,350 --> 00:22:43,290 so can I tell you thank you Ron 482 00:22:46,700 --> 00:22:45,360 I have one more question for you yes the 483 00:22:49,890 --> 00:22:46,710 French actually have a fairly good 484 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:49,900 public you have a reporting system 485 00:22:53,910 --> 00:22:51,730 through the jogger Murray they do a 486 00:22:55,740 --> 00:22:53,920 people can actually call the police and 487 00:22:57,600 --> 00:22:55,750 the police will actually investigate the 488 00:22:59,400 --> 00:22:57,610 case right unlike in the United States 489 00:23:02,250 --> 00:22:59,410 where the police send them to MUFON or 490 00:23:05,190 --> 00:23:02,260 the national UFO Reporting Center so 491 00:23:10,260 --> 00:23:05,200 have any have there been any abduction 492 00:23:12,890 --> 00:23:10,270 reports to the local police the Army has 493 00:23:17,370 --> 00:23:12,900 a very good system for reporting rapes 494 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:17,380 okay what percentage of people in the 495 00:23:23,070 --> 00:23:20,890 Army who get raped report the answer is 496 00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:23,080 about seven percent okay I've done a lot 497 00:23:31,860 --> 00:23:25,690 of studies of other kinds of hidden 498 00:23:34,170 --> 00:23:31,870 advancer so the problem is that the 499 00:23:36,270 --> 00:23:34,180 reporting system is there where people 500 00:23:38,340 --> 00:23:36,280 really are reluctant to use it I mean 501 00:23:39,900 --> 00:23:38,350 that's that's my guess I don't know that 502 00:23:45,360 --> 00:23:39,910 for a fact but I think that's probably 503 00:23:47,310 --> 00:23:45,370 the reason it's the people who have 504 00:23:49,140 --> 00:23:47,320 abductions for the most part are 505 00:23:51,300 --> 00:23:49,150 extraordinarily private they really 506 00:23:55,260 --> 00:23:51,310 don't want to talk to anybody about it 507 00:23:58,460 --> 00:23:55,270 I know cases where for instance people I 508 00:24:00,600 --> 00:23:58,470 knew who knew I was interested in UFOs 509 00:24:06,420 --> 00:24:00,610 apparently had abduction experience and